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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 10:59 am 
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While I can certainly understand the desire for the resurrection I can't begin to fathom the desire to see ANYONE destroyed.
Probably one of the things that revolted me the most about that religion was its "cavalier" attitude towards what they say will be the death of billions of people.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 2:43 pm 
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Whad'ya mean, dear P (peace, dear bruther!)? It's showing LOVE... to want all who are not like them destroyed off the face of the earth... right? You know, rather than perhaps being like Abraham... and perhaps trying to reason with JAH... on behalf of folks? You know, for some MERCY to be shown to them? So they can be SHOWN mercy? ?????

Nah, they don't get it. Well, most of 'em don't. It always felt "wrong" to me, to call folks "goats" just because they didn't want to be bothered with "us" at times. So, I KNOW there are some who don't feel right about it. May JAH have mercy on THEM... and open their ears so that THEY can hear the call... and GET OUT OF HER.

Peace, dear brother!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shellamar, hoping all is "well" with you/your household these days...


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 3:34 pm 
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There are 6 extra Jehovahs in the New WBT$ FrankenBible..
What do you do with 6 Extra Jehovahs?!!


I can put a Jehovah in the Freezer and a Jehovah in the Truck..

A Jehovah in the Closet,a Jehovah in the Vaccuum..

Now my Vaccuum really Sucks..

A Jehovah in the Attic,Hang a Jehovah on the Wall..

There`s no more Jehovahs because..

I`ve used them all..


........................................... Image...OUTLAW

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 4:18 pm 
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You are hilarious, Outlaw!


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 8:13 pm 
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PSacramento wrote:
While I can certainly understand the desire for the resurrection I can't begin to fathom the desire to see ANYONE destroyed.
Probably one of the things that revolted me the most about that religion was its "cavalier" attitude towards what they say will be the death of billions of people.

But we must admit that they deserve it. I also do not want anyone to be destroyed but if they do not care about their fellowman and especially about themselves they deserve it. No pity for them. Listen here we are suffering in our country. The criminals that are ruling us have imposed unbearable taxes on us. None has to pay those money (unless he is a thief). And yet they wait on the line like sheep to pay whereas they take loans and credit to feed their family. Fools. And it is so simple: Refrain from paying ANYTHING for one month, the country will go bankrupt and the regime will fall in a snap. So let them ruin themselves, and loose all their property and finally die from hunger.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 8:36 pm 
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But we must admit that they deserve it.


If we are to tell the TRUTH, dear ANOMOS (peace to you!), we ALL "deserve" destruction. NONE of us have been/are able to keep JAH's law... of LOVE... perfectly. Not one. Hence, we are ALL sinners... and the "wage" of sin... is death. Yes? Yet, we want mercy. Don't get me wrong: I totally understand your wanting a RELEASE from the fear and harm imposed by criminals. I do, too! But wouldn't it be a better "world" if ALL got it... God's law of love ("Love God with your WHOLE heart, soul, mind, and strength"... AND yourself, so that you CAN "love your neighbor AS yourself" and thus, "do unto others AS you would have them do unto you?" If ALL lived the law of love?

Perhaps that is what we should all be praying FOR, then, rather than Cadillacs and mansions, etc. Or whatever. For JAH's will to be done... ON earth... AS it NOW is done in the spirit realm?

Rather than for the demise of those who don't KNOW JAH... or Christ... in a fire-y end... due to their attempts to come against the beloved "city", the NEW "Jerusalem"... and gain access to the "Tree of Life"... (Christ) that (who) stands in her midst?

I do get it: we ALL want "evil" to come to an end. But HOW? By the demise of many people? Or... by ALL people coming to know JAH and doing HIS will? True, the latter most probably isn't going to occur, but shouldn't we WANT it to, pray for it to... in the HOPES that perhaps it might? You know: "Put AWAY all anger"?

Just somethin' to think about is all, dear one. Please KNOW.. that I KNOW... how hard it can be when one is suffering... or witnessing others' suffering. So I'm not judging you, at ALL. Just trying to perhaps give you another perspective, another way to "look" at it... perhaps something ELSE to ask for ("May YOUR will be done on earth..."), instead of looking forward to the demise of others, perhaps some... many... who just don't know any better! In which case, perhaps they deserve our PITY... more than our hatred?

Peace to you, dear one, in the way my Lord gives it. The kind that surpasses that of THIS world... and brings us peace in our HEARTS and MINDS!

YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,

Shellamar


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 09, 2013 9:31 pm 
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Amen to that.

Beautiful post, and full of the love that our Lord, and our Father, have given to us.


Peace to you all, as my Lord gives peace,

tammy


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 8:57 am 
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AGuest wrote:
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But we must admit that they deserve it.


If we are to tell the TRUTH, dear ANOMOS (peace to you!), we ALL "deserve" destruction. NONE of us have been/are able to keep JAH's law... of LOVE... perfectly. Not one. Hence, we are ALL sinners... and the "wage" of sin... is death. Yes? Yet, we want mercy. Don't get me wrong: I totally understand your wanting a RELEASE from the fear and harm imposed by criminals. I do, too! But wouldn't it be a better "world" if ALL got it... God's law of love ("Love God with your WHOLE heart, soul, mind, and strength"... AND yourself, so that you CAN "love your neighbor AS yourself" and thus, "do unto others AS you would have them do unto you?" If ALL lived the law of love?

Perhaps that is what we should all be praying FOR, then, rather than Cadillacs and mansions, etc. Or whatever. For JAH's will to be done... ON earth... AS it NOW is done in the spirit realm?

Rather than for the demise of those who don't KNOW JAH... or Christ... in a fire-y end... due to their attempts to come against the beloved "city", the NEW "Jerusalem"... and gain access to the "Tree of Life"... (Christ) that (who) stands in her midst?

I do get it: we ALL want "evil" to come to an end. But HOW? By the demise of many people? Or... by ALL people coming to know JAH and doing HIS will? True, the latter most probably isn't going to occur, but shouldn't we WANT it to, pray for it to... in the HOPES that perhaps it might? You know: "Put AWAY all anger"?

Just somethin' to think about is all, dear one. Please KNOW.. that I KNOW... how hard it can be when one is suffering... or witnessing others' suffering. So I'm not judging you, at ALL. Just trying to perhaps give you another perspective, another way to "look" at it... perhaps something ELSE to ask for ("May YOUR will be done on earth..."), instead of looking forward to the demise of others, perhaps some... many... who just don't know any better! In which case, perhaps they deserve our PITY... more than our hatred?

Peace to you, dear one, in the way my Lord gives it. The kind that surpasses that of THIS world... and brings us peace in our HEARTS and MINDS!

YOUR servant and a slave of Christ,

Shellamar


Yes. Put another way, there is not one person who "deserves" God's love. Not one. He loves us out of His goodness, because He is our Father and He made us, and for sheer love, because He is Love itself.

Given that none of us deserve love, but He grants it to us anyway, I don't see how we could conclude that there is anyone not worthy of His mercy. Who are we to judge another? We can't do it. No-one knows another's heart, no-one knows anyone else's innermost thoughts...and just as well, sometimes!


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 11:43 am 
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We must always be very careful not to judge others.
We may judge their actions of course, that is only right but not their faith or their intentions because we don't know them.
God does and we should leave deciding who gets punished or not to Him and His Son.


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 1:12 pm 
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We may judge their actions of course, that is only right but not their faith or their intentions because we don't know them.

The problem comes in, though, dear P (mornin' and peace to you, luv!)... when folks, in their OWN "self-righteousness"... confuse DISCERNMENT with judging. That when one says another lacks faith... is a hypocrite... or is NOT in union with Christ... such one is judging. JUDGING, however, denotes a status worthy of condemnation: one has committed a crime and another/other "judges" as to whether such one should/should not be PUNISHED for that crime, and perhaps even what the punishment should be (including eternal condemnation/destruction).

But this is not accurate. For instance, if I SEE you cold-bloodily murder someone, I can... righteously... call you a "murderer." Or if I SEE you steal sometime, I CAN... righteously... call you a "thief." Now, what should COME of you... as a RESULT... is not necessarily for me to say. Unless you murdered someone in my family (in which case, I can LAWFULLY avenge my loved one's blood; if I do, however, I am putting myself BACK under the Old Law. Under the NEW Law, I would forgive you... and leave the judging to the state, which has that RIGHT, by means of God's placing such (the superior authorities) IN the place.

And if I SEE you steal something that I KNOW is not yours and KNOW you didn't have permission to take, I can... righteously... call you a thief. I can even exhort you to RETURN the unlawfully taken item; indeed, I SHOULD do so (Matthew 18:15-18). I CANNOT, however, under the NEW Law... declare and/or condemn you to some PUNISHMENT for your theft.

So, calling you a murderer, a thief... a hypocrite... or even saying you lack FAITH... is not judging. Why? Because, Christ gave us PERMISSION to KNOW when such things are in fact TRUE: "by their FRUITS you will KNOW them." So, if one's FRUIT is murder, then we can KNOW they are a murderer. Or if one's FRUIT is theft, we can KNOW they are a thief. If one's FRUIT is hypocrisy, then we can KNOW they are a hypocrite. And if one's fruit demonstrates a lack of faith... then we can know they lack faith. THIS... is discernment, NOT judging.

If one, then, while claiming to belong to Christ... bows down before and worships an idol as his/her "God"... can we not DISCERN that such one does NOT belong to Christ, regardless of what they SAY?

Christ was not judging the people of Jerusalem when he pointed out to them where their ACTIONS/CONDUCT belied their claim of faith in God:

"Then [Jesus] said to the crowds and to his disciples: “The teachers of the law and the Pharisees sit in Moses’ seat. So you must be careful to do everything they tell you. But do not do what they do, for they do not practice what they preach. They tie up heavy, cumbersome loads and put them on other people’s shoulders, but they themselves are not willing to lift a finger to move them.

Everything they do is done for people to see: They make their phylacteries wide and the tassels on their garments long; they love the place of honor at banquets and the most important seats in the synagogues; they love to be greeted with respect in the marketplaces and to be called ‘Rabbi’ by others."


He wasn't JUDGING these; he was EXPOSING their HYPOCRISY, which he DISCERNED... NOT judged... to the people! He then addressed such hypocrites themselves:

“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You shut the door of the kingdom of heaven in people’s faces. You yourselves do not enter, nor will you let those enter who are trying to.

“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You travel over land and sea to win a single convert, and when you have succeeded, you make them twice as much a child of hell as you are.

“Woe to you, blind guides! You say, ‘If anyone swears by the temple, it means nothing; but anyone who swears by the gold of the temple is bound by that oath.’ You blind fools! Which is greater: the gold, or the temple that makes the gold sacred? You also say, ‘If anyone swears by the altar, it means nothing; but anyone who swears by the gift on the altar is bound by that oath.’ You blind men! Which is greater: the gift, or the altar that makes the gift sacred? Therefore, anyone who swears by the altar swears by it and by everything on it. And anyone who swears by the temple swears by it and by the one who dwells in it. And anyone who swears by heaven swears by God’s throne and by the one who sits on it."

“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You give a tenth of your spices—mint, dill and cumin. But you have neglected the more important matters of the law—justice, mercy and faithfulness. You should have practiced the latter, without neglecting the former. You blind guides! You strain out a gnat but swallow a camel.

“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You clean the outside of the cup and dish, but inside they are full of greed and self-indulgence. Blind Pharisee! First clean the inside of the cup and dish, and then the outside also will be clean.

“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You are like whitewashed tombs, which look beautiful on the outside but on the inside are full of the bones of the dead and everything unclean. In the same way, on the outside you appear to people as righteous but on the inside you are full of hypocrisy and wickedness.

“Woe to you, teachers of the law and Pharisees, you hypocrites! You build tombs for the prophets and decorate the graves of the righteous. And you say, ‘If we had lived in the days of our ancestors, we would not have taken part with them in shedding the blood of the prophets.’ So you testify against yourselves that you are the descendants of those who murdered the prophets. Go ahead, then, and complete what your ancestors started!

You snakes! You brood of vipers! How will you escape being condemned to Gehenna? Therefore I am sending you prophets and sages and teachers. Some of them you will kill and crucify; others you will flog in your synagogues and pursue from town to town. And so upon you will come all the righteous blood that has been shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. Truly I tell you, all this will come on this generation."


Was he judging them? No! He was telling them that their OWN ACTIONS judged them! He only DISCERNED who they were BY their actions... and so could PROPHESY the judgment that would come upon them... IF THEY DIDN'T CHANGE:

“Jerusalem, Jerusalem, you who kill the prophets and stone those sent to you, how often I have longed to gather your children together, as a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were not willing.

He KNEW they were the killers of the prophets and stoners of those sent to her... AND that they they were NOT WILLING to be gathered to him. Did he judge and condemn them? No! He told that their "house" would be left DESOLATE... of GOD'S SPIRIT... and so left empty to them... but not FOREVER:

"Look, your house is left to you desolate. For I tell you, [b][u]you will not see me again until you say, ‘Blessed is he who comes in the name of JaHVeH.”

We have been MISled to believe, however, that not only can we not call a person out on their (false/hateful/hypocritical) conduct... because such would be JUDGING... but that we should NOT... EVEN IF THEIR OWN LIVES MIGHT DEPEND ON IT! Where, though, is the LOVE in that?? If Christ left us a PATTERN to follow... footsteps that we are to TRY and walk in... and HE called not only these out, but also pointed out to his disciples when their own faith was lacking... how can WE claim to love our brother... and not call his attention to false conduct which could cost him his life?

I am not talking about "gnats" - things like getting tatoos, or working on Sunday (eye roll), or wearing knee covering skirts. I'm talking about unloving bias (say, judging single women with children, but offering all kinds of help to single men with children, etc., which I saw a LOT among JWs). Hypocrisy. Closing the door on one's tender compassion. Showing a lack of faith. Worshipping men. And things like these.

Paul not only mentioned these things, but named names. Peter discussed them, as did James and Judas. Yet, no one refers to any of these as "judging." Why?

Here's what I have come to understand from our dear Lord, dear one: we often fail to try and HELP another who claims to love/follow Christ but whose conduct indicates otherwise... because of FEAR. We consider JAH and Christ to be "exacting" and so, out of FEAR... hide our "talents/minas." We don't want to say, for fear WE might be "unclean" as well. And that IS something to consider, so of course we should scrutinize ourselves. But if we are bringing such things to the attention out of LOVE... NOT out of judging and/or thinking WE are something/better/more... and are simply pointing a finger, while ignoring our OWN errors... then there is no "law" against what we are trying to do. Because there is no law... AGAINST... love.

When we let fear KEEP us from helping our dear brother see where he may be walking with "leaven"... or where we failed to bring his attention to a wrong such as murder, etc., then we are, as Christ said of the congregation in Laodecia... "neither hot NOR cold, but LUKEWARM." And as such, risking being spat out!

No, we are not to go around constantly scrutinizing our brothers, as to what he/she does on a personal level. Maybe she keeps house this way. Or he has that as a hobby. Or maybe she dresses this way. Or he has a beard/fanatical haircut. So what? These are not things (on the "outside") that are indicative of one's love for God and Christ. It is what's INSIDE that indicates... which things CAN be manifest OUTSIDE... by conduct, etc.

So, if she's dressing a certain way in order to allure, say, another's husband... and you KNOW this... then you very well might entreat "her" to reconsider. Not only her dress, but her MOTIVE. And if he's fantically into sports because he loves "the smell of blood," them perhaps it would be a good thing to remind him of the love of Christ and how a more "balanced" view of sports would be beneficial. Or if she is displaying hypocritical conduct... or he, a lack of faith... then a warning... TO HELP PRESERVE THEM ALIVE... might be in order.

When we IGNORE, however, [demonstrations] of conduct that COULD put our dear brother/sister in danger of having their lampstand REMOVED... then we are not showing such one the love we would want SHOWN... to US. At least, the love we SAY we want. Which is, again, the preserving alive of our SPIRITS... and perhaps that of our households.

We are, some of us, however, more afraid of displeasing MEN... than we are of displeasing God and Christ. Remember, the Prophets often had hard-hitting messages for Israel, messages that directly addressed what they were doing. They were CHOSEN... because they LOVED Israel... and so would deliver such message, although harsh, with LOVE... and not with judgment and condemnation. They WANTED Israel to turn back (well, except maybe Jonah, regarding Nineveh).

Each one must, of course, again, keep a watch on themselves... NOT make their aim to be pointing the finger, but only to help snatch a loved one out of the fire.

I am sharing this with you... because, again, so many tend to confuse judging with discernment... again, entirely forgetting Christ's warning to US that "by their FRUITS you WILL know them." If their fruits show them up, then, then we can't help BUT "know" who they aren't and who they are NOT joined to. Or... Christ was speaking falsely when he said this. Which cannot be.

Now, of course, if a person of the WORLD engages in such conduct... what is that to us? They are part of the world and so to their own master they will stand or fall. Unless such one IS trying to come to our Lord, we do not need to be concerned as to what they do. It is not our job to go around looking for them and calling them "goats" when they don't respond as WE wish them to.

But if OUR Lord says to us, "You must warn your brother from me,"... and we do NOT do it... because we are afraid... either of "judging"... or of what that one might think of us... we might find ourselves having to answer for the blood of our dear brother, who brought judgment upon himself/his household... because of such conduct (including judging by HIM!).

We ARE our brothers' keepers, at least to the extent that their lives are involved. Both fleshly AND spiritual. We are NOT masters over their FAITH, however... as that is between them and Christ. That one discerns that a brother might LACK faith is NOT a judgment call... but a call to the one potentially lacking... to evaluate why the other may have said that. As James said, "Show me you faith apart from your works, and I will show you MY faith BY my works."

And so, if it IS true and one discerns that perhaps they DO lack faith... then perhaps OUR exhortation will move them to ask for MORE faith. The the PRESERVING ALIVE of THEIR spirits!

For God does NOT withhold His (holy) spirit from ANYONE asking... in faith.

I hope this helps and, again, peace to you!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shellamar


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 2:51 pm 
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Quote:
Here's what I have come to understand from our dear Lord, dear one: we often fail to try and HELP another who claims to love/follow Christ but whose conduct indicates otherwise... because of FEAR. We consider JAH and Christ to be "exacting" and so, out of FEAR... hide our "talents/minas." We don't want to say, for fear WE might be "unclean" as well. And that IS something to consider, so of course we should scrutinize ourselves. But if we are bringing such things to the attention out of LOVE... NOT out of judging and/or thinking WE are something/better/more... and are simply pointing a finger, while ignoring our OWN errors... then there is no "law" against what we are trying to do. Because there is no law... AGAINST... love.


Amen to this Shelby. Yes, we are obligated by love to help one another in this way.

Loz x

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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 3:12 pm 
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It IS interesting, is it not, dear Loz (peace, luv!), that our Lord stated what we were do to when a brother "sinned." Matthew 18:15-18 Meaning, there might be times when we were TO DO... something? Which "something" would have to first be acknowledged? How can that be, though, if we are not to address a wrong (and I am not saying nor do I think we should address ALL "wrongs" - I mean, goodness... who has the TIME... or desire???). But if it could potential hinder their LIFE...

It's also interesting, isn't it, that he didn't say, "Look out for murder... theft... adultery..." (although one should look out for those, of course!)... all of which are sins, yes, and MAN is very quick to point out... but to look out for the LEAVEN "which is hypocrisy"... which most don't recognize, ignore, or overlook? And that, although he mentioned the others, he didn't confront his disciples as to them... but DID confront the hypocrites... hypocrisy... and did NOT fail to point out to his disciples out their lack of faith?

If we look at... and TO... Christ... we will come to understand what is "judging" and what is not. Because he said HE didn't judge anyone. Yet, he pointed these things out. When we look at.. and to... MEN, however, and what THEY say "is" judging, etc., then we are more apt to be misled as to what these things truly are... and are not.

I know you get this, dear one!

Peace to you!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shellamar


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PostPosted: Thu Oct 10, 2013 3:29 pm 
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Quote:
Here's what I have come to understand from our dear Lord, dear one: we often fail to try and HELP another who claims to love/follow Christ but whose conduct indicates otherwise... because of FEAR. We consider JAH and Christ to be "exacting" and so, out of FEAR... hide our "talents/minas." We don't want to say, for fear WE might be "unclean" as well. And that IS something to consider, so of course we should scrutinize ourselves. But if we are bringing such things to the attention out of LOVE... NOT out of judging and/or thinking WE are something/better/more... and are simply pointing a finger, while ignoring our OWN errors... then there is no "law" against what we are trying to do. Because there is no law... AGAINST... love.



Yes. In fact, I used to not be able to pray for certain people... out of fear that I would also be in trouble, because of how horrible (I judged) that thing to be, and I should not be asking God to forgive such a thing as that. Though to be truthful, keeping me from praying was also often my own anger toward that person or people. And that being a lack of love.

Christ sets us free from this fear, and gives us the freedom TO love and TO forgive... because by knowing Him, we KNOW that God is NOT exacting, and that mercy and love are not punished, nor is asking/pleading for mercy to be shown to others. Because these things are from love... and perfect love (loving friend and those who set themselves up as our enemies)... drives out fear.


Peace to you!!

tammy


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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:26 am 
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Not every JW got a New WBT$ Bible..
Only the Special JWs who were Invited to the Special meeting..
Got the New Bible
JWs who aren`t Special have to wait until January to get their Bible..


............You didn`t get a New WBT$ FrankenBible because..
............................Your Not Good Enough!..
Image


Now JWs who are Not Special..
Get to watch JWs who Are Special,with their New Bibles..


I didn`t get a New WBT$ FrankenBible!..................I Hate that Effin Dog!..
........Image....................Image

........................................Image...OUTLAW

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PostPosted: Fri Oct 11, 2013 11:47 am 
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It's accessible through their website, though, dear Sher'f (peace, luv!):

http://assets.jw.org/assets/a/nwt/nwt_E/nwt_E.pdf

So looks like all one misses right now is the purty new cover!

Peace!

YSFS of Christ,

Shellamar


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