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Question?
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Author:  tec [ Wed Jun 11, 2014 2:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Question?
Peace to you all.

Someone asked me a question about something the wts teaches, and I don't know the answer, so I figured you all would. Could someone who knows tell me, what is the WTS stance on those who commit suicide? Thanks!

Your sister and servant, and a slave of Christ,
tammy
Author:  s-Kally [ Wed Jun 11, 2014 3:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
tammy...all i did was enter keywords, and dozens of hits popped up:

watchtower stance on suicide

https://www.google.com/webhp?tab=ww&ei=9ViBU7mRMMvGoATI4YDABQ&ved=0CBYQ1S4#q=watchtower+stance+on+suicide
Author:  JustJoe [ Wed Jun 11, 2014 4:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
The basic stance is that WTBTS dubs it as "self-murder", but recognizes that this can be caused by a number of factors, including mental illness, depression and others. The most recent articles basically say that Jehovah may extend mercy to some who commit self-murder. They also state that in committing this act, those people do not have a change to repent. This, of course, goes against the WT view that death acquits one from sin. Why they simply don't say, "we don't know" instead of trying to lay the blame on the person who commits suicide is beyond me.
Author:  s-Kally [ Wed Jun 11, 2014 5:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
Tammy,

Really, you should, as I higly suggest, just call a kingdom hall and ask an elder or call general counsel or any other JW.ORG REPRESENTATIVE and ask them directly "what is your stance on suicide"? They will then guide and direct you to where you can get the answer but they won't answer you directly. This is when you could say to them : well, if there were a forum or comment section onyour WONDERFUL SITE.... i could just ask there and get my question asked promptly.

I urge you to give it a go. Try here first: 845-306-0711

I'd love to hear the results of the call.
Author:  tec [ Wed Jun 11, 2014 6:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
Thanks sKally, though i just wanted a straightforward answer... something I am not likely to get on the phone with them, lol. But thanks for the link.


Leaving, thanks also. Seems like they talk out of both sides of their mouth... as usual. On this issue, basically, one can't repent... but one still could receive mercy. There is a story behind the question, but I don't think it for me to tell, so I will wait, at least for now.

So thank you and peace to you both,
your servant, and sister, and a slave of Christ,
tammy
Author:  s-Kally [ Wed Jun 11, 2014 6:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
ok, sure thing. i just figured they'd know better than anyone else, they write the stuff and make the videos.
Author:  Justmom [ Wed Jun 11, 2014 6:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
Hello Tammy and everyone...

I honestly don't remember and if there is so called new light in the past 15 years then, I'm not aware of it. But if there is only ONE unforgivable sin and the WTBS even claims this, why would they even worry about suicide and whether one is resurrected or not then? As long as they feel the person hasn't blasphemed, then it's automatic to be resurrected. But they have a lot of " grey area" issues like this that instead of just saying as LQ brought out, " WE DONT KNOW!" They speculate and always lean toward the negative to continue the fear and anguish in people to keep the control over them. Because if the WTBS is just not sure, then the terrible outcome is the most probable one as they see it.

Thanks Tammy for the question,
Love and peace to you ALL, Justmom
Author:  AGuest [ Mon Jun 16, 2014 12:34 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
I can't imagine a healthy person committing suicide (peace to you, all!), whether in body or in spirit. Christ had pity for both, those unhealthy in flesh AND those unhealthy in spirit. One way he showed his pity was by healing those with such afflictions who came to him. Whether afflicted in the flesh... or in the spirit. He healed them ALL. He also showed his pity... and LOVE... was by FORGIVING them... ALL.

The so-called "anointed" leaders of the WTBTS SHOULD know this... yes? Because such anointing is... by holy spirit? How, why, when, where, though... could that spirit lead Christ to feel... think... and do... one thing... and members of his BODY... to feel, think, and do... another?

Can't be. Cannot be. Cannot.

Not trying to answer the "What does the WTBTS believe/teach?" question. Just trying to show how they're uncertain, and so "flickering" light cannot be related to Christ. HIS... is not wavering... or flickering... Light.

Peace to you ALL!

Your servant and a slave of Christ,

Shellamar
Author:  ANOMOS [ Mon Jun 16, 2014 5:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
If you can't imagine come and visit Greece where people are jumping from the windows to escape the regime.
Author:  AGuest [ Mon Jun 16, 2014 6:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
And so you think they're healthy, luv (peace!)? Perhaps you missed my point as to "unhealthy in SPIRIT!" A broken heart, broken will, broken anything... isn't "healthy."

Peace!
Author:  tec [ Mon Jun 16, 2014 11:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
AGuest wrote:
I can't imagine a healthy person committing suicide (peace to you, all!), whether in body or in spirit. Christ had pity for both, those unhealthy in flesh AND those unhealthy in spirit. One way he showed his pity was by healing those with such afflictions who came to him. Whether afflicted in the flesh... or in the spirit. He healed them ALL. He also showed his pity... and LOVE... was by FORGIVING them... ALL.

The so-called "anointed" leaders of the WTBTS SHOULD know this... yes? Because such anointing is... by holy spirit? How, why, when, where, though... could that spirit lead Christ to feel... think... and do... one thing... and members of his BODY... to feel, think, and do... another?

Can't be. Cannot be. Cannot.

Not trying to answer the "What does the WTBTS believe/teach?" question. Just trying to show how they're uncertain, and so "flickering" light cannot be related to Christ. HIS... is not wavering... or flickering... Light.

Peace to you ALL!

Your servant and a slave of Christ,

Shellamar


Bold and underline mine... but yes, to all of this.

I had not really allowed myself to ask the question 'what about those who commit suicide?' of our Lord. I don't tend to ask questions about others' 'fate', because that is between them and Him. But when I started to think about this question, I also heard this, about how Christ would not take those who have been so trampled upon by this world (or whatever the cause of their sickness)... and then show them no mercy or love, trampling upon them again.

So yes... amen... to what you have written above.

I am also reminded now by our Lord, to share with you, that the only unforgivable sin is blasphemy against the Holy Spirit. Mark 3:28


(although Jah may of course have mercy upon whomever He chooses to have mercy upon) But suicide is not the unforgivable sin. So who is man to think he can determine and teach that suicide victims (we even call them victims) are cast out, or sent to hell - or whatever various religions have taught about this - in opposition to what Christ, Himself, has said?


Peace to you,
your servant and sister, and fellow slave of Christ,
tammy
Author:  AGuest [ Mon Jun 16, 2014 11:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
we even call them victims

Mind-numbing, almost, isn't it, dear tec (peace luv!)? That we recognize they ARE victims... yet, victimize them AGAIN, by JUDGING them! People have been committing suicide for various reasons for millenia. "Christendom" gets their judgmental opinion from the famous suicide of Judas Iscariot. Because they erroneously believe him to be the son of destruction (he was not), they see no excuse for his suicide. But Judas committed suicide because he could not LIVE... with what he had DONE. His spirit was rotten, yes. BUT... he repented. He felt SO bad that he had turned his FRIEND over, a friend who he KNEW was the Son of GOD, to be put to death... for his own greed. Who COULD live with that??? If he had NOT been repentful he would have taken his silver... and moved on.

But I will share with you a wonderful sacred secret our dear Lord JUST revealed to me: Judas is NOT lost. Indeed, he has been FORGIVEN! How so? Our dear Lord said he had not lost one, not ONE... EXCEPT the son of destruction. As I shared with you, Judas was not that person. How do we know? Because the son of Destruction had not yet been revealed. Not as in known but revealed as in ALL of creation SEEING him. Like Christ being revealed.

Destruction is an entity, as I have shared with you. A spirit being. And that being has a son. Just like JAH has a son. That entity's son is our Adversary, who CHOSE Death, the spirit Abbadon... over Life, the MOST Holy One of Israel, JAH of Armies, whose Son, the HOLY One of Israel and Holy Spirit, JAHESHUA (the Chosen One of JAH/MischJah), chose HIM.

Since the Adversary is that son (of destruction), and our dear Lord didn't lose ANY... EXCEPT the son of destruction... then he didn't lost Judas, either! JAH shows mercy to whomever He WISHES to show it... or whomever His Son wishes to show it. And ALL who repent are shown mercy.

And Judas Iscariot... absolutely repented. Again, to the point of being SO crushed (in spirit) as what he did... he could no longer live with himself. A crushed spirit, is NOT a healthy spirit. So, I stand by my assertion that healthy people don't commit suicide. AND if they are healthy but perhaps take risks that lead TO their death, that's not suicide. That's stupidity. Or, an accident. Either way.

I hope this helps!

Peace to you!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shellamar
Author:  tec [ Mon Jun 16, 2014 11:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
That IS wonderful, a wonderful sacred secret... and entirely in keeping with the mercy and forgiveness and love and truth of Christ, and God.


peace!
Author:  Armand [ Tue Jun 17, 2014 11:13 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
Peace!

And then, of course, there are the words of the Psalmist at Psalm 34:18, the words of the prophet at Isaiah 42:2-4, and the application of said prophecies at Matthew 12:20.

Amen and Amen!

P.S. "FULFILLMENT" not "application." Sorry, guys.
Author:  Justmom [ Tue Jun 17, 2014 11:33 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Question?
This is TRUTH and wonderful as it has brought tears to my eyes.

My spirt bears witness with this regarding Judas Iscariot as well. We cannot fully even fathom Jahs mercy, love and forgiveness. CHRIST is the closest to Jah we know. And his example alone should show us the kind of Father in heaven we have. Not what man has shown us, taught us or even the disciples as they were human. But CHRIST alone!!!

This has brought to mind a dream I had not long ago. It was as if I was in the kingdom and everyone around me was with me. I could not recognize ALL the faces but I just KNEW it was everyone I loved. I did not have to worry. And it was a whole lot!!! Out of the side of my right eye, I saw " ONE" that's all that was " outside" . Either cast out or chose to leave I'm not sure. But of everyone, it was only ONE.

I guess now in knowing this although not knowing who, I can pray for mercy to be extended as it had been shown to me and the rest that I saw with me.

Thank you all for sharing on this topic. Love it,
Your sister and fellow servant of CHRIST, kim
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