xjwsforChrist

Obviously, the matter hits close to home for you, dear Skals. I will try to remember that, going forward. I only ask that you (try to) remember that it doesn't for everyone. I've known some prostitutes... and "worse"... in my life... and most are actually really good people. More good, IMHO, than some so-called "clean"... self-righteous... "You'd never catch ME doing such and so..." folks. Some would even give the likes of you and me the very shirt off their backs... and go naked... so that WE don't freeze. I grew up in the streets, dear lady... and my experience has not only shown me that... but that most "You'd never catch ME doing..." folks should never say never. Because even if THEY don't eat those words (although, many do)... someone they love will. S'only a matter of time. And usually... quite embarassingly... it's their own children... or grandchildren... who need the salt and pepper.

That you think, in stating your opinion, you have a right to denigrate these girls... ANY girls... AND prostitutes... of which you know absolutely nothing about... is curious to me. Indeed, I don't think I've heard something AS JW-ish in quite a long time. Not sure where it comes from "in" you, luv, but you might wanna take a looksee and figure that out.

Peace, dear, dear lady. Always.

Your servant and a slave of Christ,

Shellamar

It is figured out shelby....have a good night sleep now.

Me? wt/ jw like...BWAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH

surely, i mean shelby, you jest.

LOLOLOL!!!

_________________
"I am proud to say that I will not lift one finger ( except my middle finger) for the WTBTS."

They do a real good job of this on their own. I have nothing to do with them getting naked for the public to gawk at them and then get paid for it.

I have a right to state my opinion and POV . And I've done so.

They denigrated themSELVES.

_________________
"I am proud to say that I will not lift one finger ( except my middle finger) for the WTBTS."

Shaking head...

SKally, isn"t this what you are doimg - concerning yourself with them? Their profession and choices?


All that Shelby said in her above post resonates with me. Because the thing I wanted to say from the start... so what even if they were prostitutess; that is still their business, and who am to judge t what someone else does to perhaps put food on the table or help a stranger or simply survive, or whatever reason? Doesn't mean that their heart does not have love written upon it. More so than the hearts of too many self-proclaimed righteous.



(sorry tyos, went to driving range...right hand/wrist is not working right, lol)



Just some things to think about if you choose to do so.


Again, peace to you,
your servant and a slave of Christ,
tammy

Actually, dear one (peace!), I was VERY serious. I actually remember this being one of the things that made me MOST uncomfortable as a JW: the judgmental attitude as to street people, prostitutes, drunks/addicts, etc. The drunks/addicts were particularly curious, as most of the JW men I knew were drunks. Sure, you don't see it at the meetings, but my ex was "popular" (eye roll) and so we hung out with a LOT of folks. And what you don't see at the KH/in field service would fill one of those books they sell.

But I always cringed when we'd call ourselves "out in field service," yet pass by the homeless person... or street walker... because either "we" just KNEW he/she didn't have the requisite "donation" ('cause we weren't given them gold-plated magazines away for free, you know!)... or because "we" were SO clean that to even TALK to a prostitute would make "us" dirty "like them." Unless, of course, they wanted a Bible Study. At which point, their "street value" jumped drastically - from an unclean person... to someone worthy of counting time on.

But as I said, I grew up in the streets. And I think you should really take care in your judging. Really. Not trying to put you down. Just trying to say that what my dear Lord said IS true: to the extent YOU judge... you will BE judged. Now, I'm sure you consider yourself "above" some things. "Clean," per se. But,again, I can't tell you how many times I've seen such words eaten. Again, if not because of the judgmental person themselves... then by their children... grandchildren... spouse... parent... partner...

Best thing is to just live... and let live... without trying to be a moral compass as to the physical sins of anyone else.

But, well, I realize that not everyone gets that, so...

Peace to you, dear Skals.

Your servant and a slave of Christ,

Shellamer, who grew up around some pretty "ol' fashioned" folks...

Just a quick FYI:
The Body book was/is suppose to be about the fact that every person looks different and to celebrate those differences.
It has elite athletes, the best and best conditioned in the world, and they ALL look different.
Some are big and some small, some are ripped and some "fat", some have big boobs and some have small, men, women, ALL types of bodies.
That was the point of the whole issue ( and there are others out there too by the way, not just ESPN).
http://www.amazon.com/Athlete-Howard-Sc ... ds=Athlete

Sure sex sells and there is no gray area there, who are we kidding.
Nevertheless, it is important for all to realize that high performance bodies come in all shapes and sizes and that you will find MORE elite athletes that do NOT look like magazine models than you find that do.
And most that do, do look that way because they WANT to look that way not because they need it to be successful in their sport.

Thank you, thank you, THANK you, dear, dear P (mornin' and peace to you!). Perhaps the reason dear Skal's (peace, luv!) "position" reminded me SO much of the JW mindset is because it was proffered without knowledge. Here, the assumption was money for nakedness, versus the, well, kind of noble, if you ask me, goal of showing that there is not one body "type," even among elite athletes. I always marveled that JWs spoke as if they "knew"... and many who once were but no longer are... do, as well. I often wondered... and wonder still, sometimes... what is the BASIS of such "knowledge"? Folks who don't read (anything except WTBTS literature), don't watch television, don't read the newspapers/periodicals, barely or didn't finish high school, don't work outside the home (many), don't associate with anyone other than JWs, etc... on what... besides the lies and false propaganda of the WTBTS... do they BASE their so-called "knowledge"??

Because of the WTBTS teachings... and I realize our dear Skals left very long ago but not before her formative years, and so perhaps some things were actually inculcated that SHE isn't even aware of... so many make very closed-minded comments and/or are very limited in what they CAN talk about with some (real) knowledge. They like to talk... and opine... but often it's totally baseless. And people who were NOT JWs... or know life BESIDES WTBTS-world... are like... "Huh? What a minute - didn't you say you WEREN'T a JW???"

There is nothing wrong with having an opinion. But surely, we ALL wants our opinions to be based on SOME kind of fact/truth... and not just something from the top of OUR head... or heart... which may be limited due to the limitations not only the WTBTS but we ourselves have placed on ourselves, yes?

Somewhere, we were taught that prostitution is "wrong." Many believe the Bible "says so." But I can't find that anywhere in the Bible, per se. There are temple prostitutes... concubines... my Lord released prostitutes from their heavy consciences... even publicly forgave a woman caught in the act of adultery. In doing so, he suggested to those who brought her forth and would have condemned her to go ahead - let the one WITHOUT sin throw the first stone.

There is a saying, "To know someone you really need to walk a mile in THEIR mocassins." Unfortunately, JWs... and those with the JW mindset (STILL), don't get what that means. Don't get that they haven't a CLUE as to why someone might do something. Nor do they bother to take a look and perhaps LEARN why. As here, where the goal is NOT to sell sex... but to CELEBRATE the DIFFERENCES in the physical form... by showing that there are differences... and perhaps beauty... in the DIFFERENCE(S).

Tall is NOT better than short. Light skin is NOT better that dark. Greater endowment is NOT better than lesser. The male form is NOT better than the female form. Cut muscles are NOT better than softer sinew. Thin is NOT better than fat. And vice versa as to all of these truths. ALL of these are just as good as the other... and people who are, perhaps, obsessed with ONE appearance of the physical form... are either UNINFORMED... IGNORANT... or BLIND. Or... all of these.

And people who consider those who wish to make this truth clear by showing THEIR (different) form... to be "prostitutes"... are also uninformed. And unenlightened... and ignorant... and blind... contrary to what they might think.

Thing is, no one HAS to be uninformed, ignorant, or blind as to these things. They can... CHOOSE... to know the truth. Or... they can insist on their own "righteousness." Their choice.

But I don't have a lot of patience for the JW "mindset" anymore, at least, not coming from an actual... active... JW. I mean, at least those folks have an EXCUSE. Flimsy one, yes, given their claims of being "christians," but still... I understand why THEY'RE still uninformed: their "mama" won't LET them come to the Light. Or, at least, CONSIDER the truth.

And that's all I'm going to say about THAT.

Again, peace to you... and thank YOU... for sharing the TRUTH about the purpose of the project with us.

YSSFS of Christ,

Shellamar

Thank you Paul for bringing that fact to light!

Peace to you,
your sister, and servant, and a fellow slave of Christ,
tammy

I can't claim to know why ANYONE would pose nude (explicit or not) BUT I do know that for elite athletes its not about the money ( they have lots).
Can it be about vanity? of course.
Very easy to see how a person can be proud of how they look.
The thing is that we do NOT know the intentions of others nor do we have control over what others decide to judge those intentions by.
All I can tell you is that when I h ave read those books and magazines and shown my wife, we admired the bodies of those that put so much time into them, the dedication and effort.
The vast majority NOT to look good but to be the best in their sport.
I showed my eldest the athlete one so she could see that people, even elite athletes, come in all shapes and sizes.
We may not be able to control why other do things or how others perceive them BUT we can control what WE DO and what WE perceive.

I didn't even know Venus posed nude. I don't follow her activities or her sport. But I was curious as to what the commotion about it was here LOL so I looked it up. OMG she is gorgeous, and what a tasteful nude pose it is. All her lady bits are covered so it's not at all a lewd picture. I don't find it in the least bit "filthy". It would be different if she was laying down with her legs spread wide displaying everything, inviting all to feast on her sexual parts.

BUT I think I see what Skally is going on about. Venus claims to be a JW so posing nude would generally be against their moral compass. If a ordinary baptized rank and file woman posed nude for a magazine she most likely would be disfellowshipped. But Venus is not baptized and she is a celebrity so the WT doesn't go there with it. They are suddenly not worried about what shame she might be bringing on the religions good name because people admire Venus. Even though I can't see what shame there is in a beautiful body.

Corporate religions, ALL of them, have always had and will always have the corporate " triune godhead" ie: Money, power, influence, as the most important thing for them.
Hypocrisy, they name is organized religion

What, though, CAN the WTBTS "do" about it, dear Zoe (peace, luv!)? While THEY may claim a loyalty to the WTBTS, they are not baptized.



And we know that... HOW?? What can they say ABOUT THE CONDUCT OF UNBAPTIZED (into the WTBTS) people??

And do we REALLY know that the WTBTS takes money from them? Knowingly? We are assuming, and it's likely, yes. Either directly or perhaps through their parents (which is more likely). But WHAT religions questions such donations?? Heck, the RCC even took/takes from the MOB! As does the Orthodox (Russian mob). And Buddhism/Shintoism (Japanese, Korean, Chinese, and other mobs). ALL of whom make their money ON prostitution. And extortion. And racketeering. And murder.

None of us knew there was a problem with Michael Jackson... until HE DA'd himself. But apparently someone DIDN'T like what he was doing... else they wouldn't have said anything to him to cause him to WANT to DA. But he was baptized. We don't hear anything negative about Prince... and if folks don't think HE sells sex, then they haven't listened to HIS music. Or seen one of his concerts.

If these girls ARE donating to the WTBTS, THEY are not doing so for a BAD reason; they THINK they're "doing good" to Christ's "brothers." Being elite athletes doesn't automatically make THEM any smarter than anyone else when it comes to these things... or immune from being misled/fleeced.

So, if anything wrong is occurring, it is the WTBTS TAKING their money... under ANY circumstances. So, why be mad at the GIRLS??? AND all but call them prostitutes??



Thank you AGAIN, dear P (and peace to you, again!).



Oh, I'm SURE there's some of THAT involved! But these girls don't make their LIVING saying "Look at my body!" That their bodies are in the shape they're IN is the result of how they make their living - as PROFESSIONAL tennis athletes. Which REQUIRE a body that is in shape!



In THIS society?? You BETCHA! Probably won't see many girls in this shape being kidnapped and sold as sex slaves, though...



S'all I'm sayin'. Well, I'm sayin' a little bit more than that... 'cause I'm not sure that TRUTH is very CLEAR...



I admire the dedication and hard work. But the bodies are just bodies... to ME. Not that I don't appreciate what they mean to THEM. Let me explain:

I am reminded of something dear hubby shared with me the other day. I had shared with him what our dear Lord said to me during a discussion we were having. It was about those who ask, "Why her/him and not me?" He said that the answer to the question is the question itself. If one has to ASK why not them... then THAT'S why not. Because there is NOTHING that one can have or do... that ANOTHER can't have or do. Shoot, we have people with missing limbs competing in Olympic games! People with under "average" IQs!

One doesn't HAVE... because one does not want what comes WITH so as TO have. To which dear hubby shared with me where he'd heard of someone saying to a premier violinist:

"I'd give ANYTHING to play like you!"

To which the violinist responded, "No, you wouldn't!"

Well, the person was taken aback, even offended a little. And then the violinist said:

"I've spent thousands of hours practicing and practicing in order to be able to play like this. If YOU would give ANYTHING, YOU would give thousands of hours to practice, too! But you won't... and so you DON'T play like I do... nor can you!"

There is NO way on God's green earth that I could... or would... dedicate the time... or effort... to playing tennis like those girls. Or body building... for ANY reason. Sport or otherwise. Just not MY "thing." The ONLY thing I dedicate such time and effort to... is serving JAH and Christ. Behind that, it would be raising my kids. Although, I probably "exercise" my BRAIN as much as some athletes exercise their bodies. But NOTHING else, besides the first two, matters THAT much... to ME. To me. What anyone else finds worthy of such time and effort is totally on them. I digress.

That physicality matters to some... and so their hard work is born out in their ability to excel at their sport... AND in the bodies they've DEVELOPED to allow them to excel at such sport.



Boo-yow.



GOOD show! Hopefully, you showed her some pics of folks who exercise that other "muscle"... the brain... too, yes? And I'm SURE they're not all "cut" and "buff" and such. Stephen Hawking comes to mind - LOLOL!



We can, luv. Thing is... DO we? Or do we continue with the same "lame" brain-ness that we developed by being a part of the WTBTS... which was their goal from the start: to put us to SLEEP, mentally... so as to put us in a COMA... spiritually!

I realize that exercising muscles is a difficult thing. Exercising physically is easier for some than for others. Same thing with the brain: exercising it can be easier for some than for others. Both, however, really come down to what a person WANTS to do. And for BOTH... "no pain... NO gain."

Peace!

A slave of Christ,

Shellamar, who was "almost done" commenting... but your dear one's comments compelled me to continue, so...

Ideally we should exercise and fully develop all our facets:
Brain,Body AND Spirit.

On a side note, it has been proven and shown over and over for some time now that for women, strength training is far more important than aerobic training because:
A) you get both anerobic and aerobic with strength training.
B) and perhaps more important, strength training strengthens BONES as well as muscles.
Every woman knows what I am getting at.

Shel, my eldest Sofia LOVES to read, she finished hunger games in the 3 hour flight to Cuba.
The thing is that she is very fit, she is lean, muscular, very fast ( she is a swimmer and sprinter) and she already gets teased at school for being "too fit" and such.
It was important for her to see that WOMEN can be fit, muscular or thin or "thick" or whatever shape they are and still be very health and good at their sport and that NO ONE gets to decide what SHE or ANY WOMAN is "suppose" to look like.

I am glad your dear Sofia got that message, dear P (peace, dear brother!). I hear you on the "brain/mind, body, and spirit" thing, luv... but I have to share that I received a different outlook from our dear Lord.

His words directly, to his first century CE disciples and, a great deal of time later, to me:

"The spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing"... (John 6:63)

And, through JAH's Prophet, Samuel:

“Do not consider his appearance or his height, for I have rejected him. JaHVeH does not look at the things people look at. People look at the outward appearance, but JaHVeH looks at the heart.” (1 Samuel 16:)

So, again, while I do admire athletes for their dedication and skill... for instance, a well-toned and so powerful tennis player... I have the same admiration for, say, a 350-lb linebacker... who might not be as toned... but is just as powerful in the way HIS sport needs him to be. Flubber may not always be "pretty", as some of us consider attractiveness... but it can protect the bones, when need be. And there CAN be a "golden" heart hiding behind it.

But I hear you, luv. Thing is, we all know that one day what the flesh looks like... or can do... won't matter one way or the other. According to our dear Lord, though, that day has already long arrived. Question is... do we hear... and BELIEVE him... when he says that?

Peace to you!

YSSFS of Christ,

Shel